I sat down with Kyle Anderson from Mobius Brass to talk about what’s happening with reloading, the availability of reloading components and more. Don’t miss this great interview!
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Reloading in 2021 Whats Happening? Episode 87
00:00:00 – 00:05:05
Get ready for certified. Usda prime gun stuff on the gun. Guy tv podcast. Hi this is joel singer. I’m the guy. Thank you very much for all of your support of gun guide. Tv am very grateful for everything you do. Please don’t stop now before. I get into the interview with kyle. From moebius brash. Let me remind you that gun guy. Tv does need your support. If you’d like to support this podcast and the youtube channel and video channel you can do so many different ways one of the ways you can do. It is a way that costs you absolutely nothing. You can use our affiliate links to buy stuff so if you go to the description of this podcast you’ll find a link to our website at gun guide dot tv. We put a page up. They’re entitled discounts on gear. Now if you don’t find the link you can just go to our website at gun. Guide dot tv and for the menu item discounts on gear. It’ll take you to where we put all of our affiliate lakes. There you can get discounts had called well shooting crimson trace Reloading equipment from frankford arsenal. Safes from lockdown. Smith and wesson accessories tipped in planning wheeler tools. Optics planet even amazon. How about that. In addition there are other sites at may not give you a discount. They come and go so there might be a discount sometimes might not be otherwise but they do support gun guy. Tv with every purchase regardless and. That’s acre leather bullet safe premier body armor our tactical second call defense spartan armor police gear and more. Those are places. You can buy stuff that you might buy. Otherwise including as i said even amazon. And whatever you buy there is going to benefit gun guy tv and in many cases you’re going to get a discount for your purchase so check it out. It’s in the lincoln. The description that says discounts on gear. And if you can’t find that the just go to our website at gun guide dot tv and look for the discounts on gear menu item. Now let’s get started with the interview with moebius brass. Well so tell me kyle. What’s going on with moebius brashear. My favorite brash player. By the way. What’s what’s happening with you. I i don’t even know frankly and i’d be interested to know how you got into this business. Well it’s interesting I i always enjoy telling people this story because it’s kind of happened by accident so I would say probably about eighteen months ago I got my first maximum. You go further back than that For any beers are listening. That don’t live in california. There was a proposition that passed in twenty sixteen called prompt Three now prop sixty three pass. It said that in. I believe it was two thousand eighteen July two thousand eighteen any ammo purchases made after that date would have to go through the knicks the knicks system but the dro system So you’d have to get a background check so it was at that point that i decided okay. I need to get a machine to reload this. I need to roll my own. So in i believe he was later that year Probably december december of two thousand sixteen. I bought my first. Dylan’s i bought a six fifty. And i was just using it to load nine. Well one thing led to another. And i’m like you know what i needed to start loading. Rife around so. I bought a Ten fifty in three eight. I learned very quickly that if you’re loading progressive so if you’re not prepping your brass before you loading on a progressive especially three await. It’s it’s it’s tough. So i switched back to single station my three weight and i switched the ten fifty over two five six so i would say a year later i I got tired of doing the brass. Br up and i had been to shot show in twenty. I believe it’s twenty nineteen. And i saw the dylan booth and i looking around and i noticed that they had a case promising. A dedicated case pro machine is the thousand. I fell in love with it and They said it would be out april that here. Well if anybody is familiar with dylan. They know that they’ll and there are charitable to say the least so one thing led to another and it ended up coming out in november. I got one of the first machines to come available. And i loved it’s on the. Cpi two thousand you. It caps wages. You can put the The new dylan trimmer on there. So you can fulling size and trim in one go so basically with with each stroke of the the press you get a full. Excuse me a fully prepped. Piece of brass as opposed to having to do one step at a time. Which is what. I do Yup and i started doing five six brass prep on a frankford arsenal preps in which is great. If you’re not doing bulk so like if you had your specialty rifle cartridge six. Pse three and a win mag that kind of thing like if you’re only doing two hundred cases that thing is amazing but you know you’re doing thousand two thousand rounds of five six at a time.
00:05:05 – 00:10:05
It gets old quickly. So i switched to the c. P. on like you know what i don’t wanna keep spoken this by hand or running the running around by hand and so i said i’m going to get an honor drive so i bought an animal bot. I think it was a couple months later. And so i got my. Cpi in an animal bought. And this is a good amount of money to put into this machine. Like you know what. I should start a business with this well. That was Over a year ago and right around july. I was like i really get going with this. We just moved into a new house march and I said i really need to get off my behind and do this. So i got all the business stuff taken care of. And i started sort of movie strasser. One machine why. Do i get the feeling that your garage does not. How’s your car anymore. Because is correct. And i can tell you one thing. I want to get out of my garage so bad because like i. It’s it’s so messy in there. I have two concrete mixer tumblers. And i have a eight or nine foot story her. It’s like man. It’s it’s a zoo now is that where is that. Where your business set up in your Yeah yeah you got nothing in there except no work and work pretty much and that’s it. That’s that’s amazing. How many machines are you run now. for brass. It’s still just to. I have a third one on the way. Because i’m going to get I’m going to get the machine to keep her to process nine. Because right now i have i wanna say close to one hundred thousand rounds of nine to process so i you know i’ve with the current output i can do About three thousand dollars an hour. So if i get to machines that will basically double that and the nine. I can’t keep an eye out on the shelves. In fact i just started going back orders on nine in early sold out so i need. I need to get more More throughput you know. That’s something that probably we should talk about. Is the fact that you’ve got. You’re sitting on one hundred thousand rounds that need to be processed so it’s not an issue of brass not being available. It’s an issue of keeping an eye on the website and getting it as quickly as as you can or submitting a back order in order to get the brass. It’s it’s not that the grass is hiding somewhere that you can’t get it. It’s a the issue is that everybody grandmothers trying to get brass. And if you’re not you haven’t essentially saved your spot in line by getting a back order in then you’re not gonna get it. It’s gonna go faster than it could be produced in. I’ve been pretty Studious with Rascasse a lot of guys They’re asking me for unprocessed brass. And i it’s not economical for me to buy brass by the ton and I let me let me back up. Brass prices right now. I’m sure you know our office scale. I’ve actually had a couple of guys tell me that unprocessed in the term once fired is it’s a misnomer but range breasts of range. There’s people that are paying like five cents a piece for range breasts. That’s just raw nine. Millimeter range brass. That’s not nothing’s been done to it. And when i heard that people are paying five around for that. I i can’t charge that because that’s that’s ridiculous. I charge eight cents it. Yeah eight cents for fully process breath and five cents on process like typically if a republican was president. And we didn’t have all this one this going on. I think the average price of raw nine would be between two and a half and three cents a piece so it’s it’s almost it’s more than doubled for unprocessed brass. It’s it’s it’s it’s amazing. I never seen anything like this shooting straight and always right on target. This is the gun guy to heap. Podcast one more way that you can help support young guy. Tv is to support us by going to practical defense systems for your security officer training if you’re in california and you’re interested in getting into security or you already work in the security industry we’re a state license security officer training facility. We’re basically vocational school. And that’s the company that my wife. And i own so if you do your initial licensing training to get into security or your continuing education that you have to do every year with practical defense systems not only. Do you support that company. Not only you’re going to get good training not only. Are you going to save money. But you’re also going to help support gun guy. Tv so check us out at practical defense. Systems. you’ll find a link in the description or you can just go to p. d. s. classes dot com. Now let’s get back to the interview with kyle. What do you attribute the craziness of buying ammo to. Why are people buying hamill buying everything as fast as they can get it. It was honestly the best resource that i’ve seen on this subject is the ceo of Federal her the the parent company.
00:10:05 – 00:15:03
Don’t federal he. They basically said that the the gun market has been so heavily inundated with new gun buyers and they said that seven million gun buyers bought each bought two boxes of ammo. it was just some astronomical amount of of one that we need to be produced. So i think it’s a combination of that and it’s a combination of the the concern That people have for especially with what we’re getting out of congress in the white house with You know mandatory gun buybacks in this this whole malarkey with the manufacturer’s liability that just came out a couple of days ago and i mean that’s really concerned the average citizen but any kind of gun. Bill will cause a panic. And i remember very clearly after newtown happened in twenty thirteen. I this is when i was first getting into guns. And i was just like gobsmacked at how quickly the shelves empty it was. Man you’re in california. Took almost four usually animal market to recover. So i’m i’m genuinely curious how long it will take for this this this go around to To rectify itself. I have a feeling it’ll be a while you know during that time in twenty thirteen my company practical defense systems. We had a sort of a back channel for ammo and we had gotten in the habit because we qualify security officers throughout the state. We’ve gotten in the habit of stocking a lot of ammunition and then we had pistols for them to borrow in use in case they didn’t own their own but the ranges that we qualified these folks at were routinely completely dry. I mean they didn’t have One round of anything in it was really shocking. How difficult it was for. Ranges to acquire emo had. We not made the decision we made when we made it to stockpile ammunition crazy we would have been forced out of business or a number of companies. That were you know to your point. There are a couple of news stories that were just out today. I found interesting. One is in breitbart by john. Nolte and its opinion. It’s an opinion piece and it says great americans. This is the title. Great americans are buying guns with biden’s stimulus check. I can’t think yeah. That’s that’s that’s the best title. I’ve ever heard a news you know. What else are you going to do with the stimulus. Check right if you go out and buy a gun and show. That’s what folks are doing. And apparently nolte went out and interviewed a bunch of gun store owners. And they’re telling him that this is what happened with the last stimulus check. And so they’re They’re anticipating a lot of sales increase. Based upon the stimulus checks. That just went out. And then there’s another story that was in bearing arms today. California gun sales skyrocketing media asks why i can’t imagine why gee it’s almost like people are concerned. Yeah i wonder. I wonder why that could be shocking. Well now where do you think. I saw a couple of things on your website. First of all. I want to repeat. Kyle’s got brass. it’s just a matter of getting your order. And and make sure you get that back order in or just watching the website and pouncing on it when you see it because right now people are buying things just as fast as they’re available and so you want to get in there and get your order in at moebius brass. And you’ll get brash. The problem is the other components most notably primers. I looked today. And i could not find primers anywhere except for two. Oh nine shotgun primers. I found those your. They’re not a whole lot of them. But i found him but anything pistol rifle. Forget about it. i couldn’t find that the powders. I’m starting to see coming back a little bit. Where i’m starting to see powders. Not necessarily the most popular ones but nevertheless if you’ve got good loading data and You check and see if these powders work you might be able to get powder the problem that i’m seeing and bullets by the way you can get bullets at one place or another. You may not be exactly what you’re looking for but if you’re running for range bullets plenty of those around but primers are tough and yet i saw on your website. Small pistol primers. What’s that used ones. So i’m glad you asked about that. Because i get a lot of questions about that. A lot of guys so when The last round or the time that there was a massive shortage like this Guys became. I mean the ingenuity was always there but they put ingenuity to use in what they were doing they were actually pulling the anvils out of framers tapping the The dent out of the primer cup putting their own homemade priming compound in there and then putting the envel- in so they were reloading primers. There are recipes online to reload or to to make your own Priming compound have never tried that. I don’t have that much time but I have seen it done and how. How reliable are those asking questions on.
00:15:03 – 00:20:00
Who’s making them. I would imagine so. I think it determines it depends on how Attentive to detail the The loader is because i. I mean when you’re talking a tenth of an ounce a tenth of a grain of framing company. I would imagine that the the chemistry makes a pretty big deal especially in small small primers. I saw a video of a guy who was using caps the little caps from a cap gun and he was taking cutting out the caps and he figured out with a couple of different primers he was using that if he put into either two or three caps. I don’t know but you could probably find the video on youtube somewhere navy put two or three caption there and then was very studious about the way reset the animal that they were. They were fairly reliable. Got nine out of ten of them to fire which was a very ingenious people. Make sure you stock up on these roles of caps and you only smoke. You know it’s So you know there was my grandfather used to say where there’s a will there’s relative. No that’s how that goes. Where there’s a wilders away people will find a way but i found it interesting that you had small pistol primers used ones for sale. That’s ashland on me. I got another one for you I i’ve had several is actually asking me for Spent twenty two cases and choosing. Yeah yeah. I thought they were to reload Twenty two which. If i mean i guess if you had enough time it would be. You know you could reload twenty two. You’d have to. There’s a lot of labor that goes into it. But i have since found out that i think guys are doing with them is. They’re making them into jackets and casting their own bullets. So they’re taking the twenty two case in forming into jacket and then Boring leading behind it. How interesting is that. I thought you were going to tell me. They were trying to extract the remainder. The remainder of any of the priming compound wouldn’t think there is any once. It’s burnt burnt china’s left in there. But that’s interesting in their own making their own jackets for their own bullets. Well like i said you know where there’s a willer there’s a way and people will find a way. What do you see happening right now. I mean you said you. You don’t know how this will pan out or how long it will take but you probably have your finger on the pulse of the i. Primer market and the component market. Better than i so what are what are your thoughts. I have a couple of theories on that I i personally think that I think a lot of things. But i think that based on what. I’ve researched that wolf and I don’t think it sells the prime insured but wolf primers are going to be imported again at least from because i spoke with wolf Not in any meaningful industrial way just as a customer and they said that they were looking be importing them again this month and i have a feeling that what happened the last time in two thousand thirteen two thousand fourteen is a lot of companies. Were putting back orders in for back with like five different companies and they were back warning for the entire amount that they needed. So when one of those companies delivered they cancelled the other backers. I actually haven’t seen any will framers ever since then so i. I’m locals to say that. I think that they’re going to be importing them again but they. They told me that they were thinking about importing them again. So i have. I hope that with wolf importing primers again that it will kinda ease the strain of Of the need for primers in the other problem that i think is that a lot of times This isn’t really. i mean. i’ve never seen this really in in our. You know in in the gun world but with like sneakers and You know high demand fashion items. There’s a lot of people that use shopping bots or I don’t know what else you’d call them. They’re like advocaat’s or whatever well they’ll they’ll go in and the by Like let’s say the bass pro puts ten thousand primers up. Well they’ll they’ll program something to go and buy all ten thousand of those primers before anybody else’s a chance to as soon as their stock so it’s constantly hitting the web page in hitting refresh and this is all automated by a lot well in recent months. I’ve noticed that Listen to the people that i’ve talked to that That those bodies of it. They’re getting rejected because the traffic on the web page or the the I don’t know if it’s fire while or whatever but the there’s an appliance blocking traffic on the web page so the scalpers that are taking these Primers by ten thousand women throwing them up on gun. Broker are being Stopped which is of excellent excellent thing. I was kinda shocked that these people getting away with it. Because i this is all secondhand stuff.
00:20:00 – 00:25:07
I don’t know anybody that does this but it. It’s it’s good to see that it’s good to see the companies being responsible and letting people who otherwise wouldn’t have access to these primers get these primers. You’re listening to the tv podcast. Please pay no attention to the man behind the curtain. One thing. I want to remind you very quickly before we get back to the interview. Is that this podcast. Like all the others is split into two sections. The first half hour is available. Free on your favorite podcast player and on the various video platforms like youtube and so on the second half. An hour is available only on patriot. If you’d like to hear the entire interview please come join us on patriot. You’ll find a link in the description you could support gun guy. Tv that way and get a lot of content that you don’t get anywhere else. It’s exclusive only to patriots patrons or you can just go to patriot for that matter and just search for gun guy. Tv all right back to the interview. You rick travis at the california rifle and pistol association and i were talking about this and he was saying that he had actually been in conversation with several apparently of the larger firearms ammunition manufacturers and what they had told him as that the big deal with primers right now as they really have to use their primers to make their ammunition and they don’t have extra primers to put out there for sale for the reloading market. What do you. What do you think of that view. Do you think that’s accurate. I one hundred percent agree with that because And i’ve actually heard that from several guys when the when the sh- they’re not shops their their factories of of ammunition when the when the factories of or the factories that by primers by the pallet. Can’t get those primers. There’s a problem. And i think that’s gonna cause if if i’m already caused A lot of stress for some ranges. And i’ve heard Stories of companies startup companies that Make ammunition in a standard way and the result of that initiative of being fired shows. I’ve heard more than one occasion that some some started companies that nobody’s heard of before have doubles or double charges or Squibb’s and so i i one hundred percents agree with that. So you get people who shouldn’t really be making ammo because they’re just doing to make the money right now who are making ammo to fill that void because they have access to certain crimes but you know on the wholesale market yeah. I- hundred percent agree with that. Well you’ve talked about the investment that you’ve made just in machinery in your own shop. And i was sitting here while you were talking about it. Because i’m fairly aware of the cost of dylan stuff and my wallet was about to have a heart attack. Because you’re telling me the various things you bought but even when you when you think about that as an individual starting a small business that’s a that’s a herculean task to dedicate the funds to go buy additional machinery. Get the machinery setup. Get it running and so on but when you’re an ammo manufacturer all boy. It’s a different proposition because not only are you investing billions of dollars in new tech and new equipment. You have to have a place to put that equipment so you’ve gotta have now warehouse space. You’ve got to have people to run that equipment. You’ve got to go through the licensing to be able to make the ammunition because some of those things like primers or so on are considered hazmat and the making of ammunition has a lot of various incendiary regulations associated with both federal and state and probably local. So there’s a lot of stuff it’s not turn the flip the switch thing so these manufacturers can say. There’s a run ammunition right now. We can’t make it fast enough. Let’s just dust crank on a couple more machines. It doesn’t work that way does. Oh no. that’s that’s absolutely correct. And actually what i’ve what i’ve seen is It’s not even companies that You would normally associate with amunition industry. It’s it’s companies like whoa they make ammo and it actually turns out that they’re not making their own ammo. They’re importing it or doing something where they’re getting it at reduced costs or they’re not making at all and just importing it from somewhere else. So it’s it’s it’s really kind of interesting. It’s a very interesting dynamic in. It’s it’s something that as a consumer. I don’t really think that people think about that especially because You know when when i was just getting any guns like i didn’t think this mccain from it just you know showed up at walmart or whatever and there was there was but it’s it’s there’s a lot that goes into making that especially on the liability side of things. That’s why i don’t make amel. Because i the there’s only one word for the dedication it takes run these machines with a consistency that i would be comfortable with putting my name on it is. It’s i mean it’s the learning curve alone for brass. Prep is pretty steep. Now when you add a priming throwing charge seating a bullet cramping and then chamber checking everything leaves.
00:25:07 – 00:30:12
That’s just a lot more work and it’s a lot more liability and i think that When you look at you know how federal makes will they have. I don’t know what kind of machines they have know. Above dylan there’s camdessus in man candidate serve. They’re nice but they’re very expensive. But there’s a significant investment in In components in machines. And there’s just there’s a lot to be learned and so i think that A lot of times people who are just doing Or making munition for the the quick buck of it aren’t necessarily going through the correct way of making all this stuff and just sending out a lot the door. That has no business being out there. You know it’s an interesting thing. When you think about the number of rounds that are made every year ammunition manufacturers and the astronomically low incidence of accidents that harm anyone it. If you really think about it. I mean any given round if made improperly can blow a gun up somebody loses. A digit loses an eye. Oh yeah Or perhaps loses a life and yet these manufacturers pump this ammunition out at incredible rates and yet urkel. It’s a it’s there’s such an attention to detail and such an attention to quality control that you can confidently go. Buy a box of ammunition. Go to the range and be assured with With almost one hundred percent accuracy. Not quite but almost that every time you press the trigger. You’re going to do so safely and that’s an astounding thing yet requires a tremendous investment. I think the other thing too if you think about it is. These types of runs on things are often temporary. So if i’m a business owner which i am and i’m saying to myself ok order to handle this. If we really want crank up enough to do it. I’ve got to invest a lot of money. Hire people get a location. Go through this licensing and so on and then what happens if i do that. And then this rush wains. What do i do with all that equipment. What do i do with all that money we spent. What do i do with all the people we hired. How do i explain that to. Our stockholders blew all this money. And now we’ve got all this stuff sitting around island. We have to lay off all these folks so i wonder if that doesn’t enter into the calculation as to why they don’t do it as well. Well i think honestly. And i should be clear with this. Is that a lot of times. What i’ve seen is it’s not necessarily companies. it’s actually individuals that are there there And they’re well they’re selling legally there I’ve seen actually before number or people actually admit that they’re selling their own reload. And you know obviously you need the nfl six to sell it and you know you hear stories about people buying reload at gun shows or whatever and they’re the attention to detail is not there so if you if you have a guy who’s sitting on thirty thousand primers and has enough components to make you know twenty thousand rounds of nine. Sometimes he might just do that and try to get away with it on gun broker. And i’m i was just floor. I keep hearing stories about this man that that that the initials and those will potentially blow. Yup i mean between what i was talking about before was amunition companies. We’re talking about federal and remington and hornets show on these companies. Make so much ammunition and and it doesn’t yup. Yeah but you’re right. I mean i’ve i’ve been reloading forever and loading. I don’t have a radio on. I don’t if somebody wants to come in and talk to me. I stop what i’m doing Because if you’re not paying attention you can screw up and you can double charge a case you can have a squib you can do yourself some damage. I actually know a guy who was walking across his garage with a tube full of primers for his dylan and stumbled on something and dropped it and It went pop. Nobody was hurt but ring. And you know and so it’s Their stuff in there. That can really hurt if you’re not paying attention so if you’re buying i would urge folks. I know when i reload ammunition and i loaded. I know i can take it to the range in. Its shave. But i don’t know that about the other guy and so i don’t. I don’t use other people’s loach forget it. You know if. I’m buying ammunition. It’s gotta be factory new ammunition if i’m looking at myself. I’m fine with that but other than that. Forget about it. I concur one hundred percent. I honestly say that. That’s that’s a good macho to shoot. Don’t shoot anyone else’s reload except your own. That’s really the bottom line of it. Because i mean i. I’m sure you’ve heard stories as well. Just of a mix ups you know. Somebody ends up putting tight group and a rifle case in. Oh man no no. I haven’t heard the stories remember. I’ve been an instructor for a couple of decades. That’s right. I’ve been a law enforcement instructor and and security instructor for decades i’ve taught thousands and thousands of people how to shoot we Band absolutely banned the use of any reloaded ammunition on the range during any classes.
00:30:12 – 00:31:28
But i have attended courses where that wasn’t the case and seen accidents now. Fortunately in all the ones i’ve seen while guns were destroyed and and You know and certainly You know you you say gee i that just scared me. At ten years of my life. Nobody was seriously hurt. Nobody lost at digital. And i ever was more shocking and alarming than anything else. But there certainly are instances where people get seriously injured. And so yeah. That’s a that’s a great rule. Don’t shoot other people’s reload just use your own and don’t go on gun broker. My advice don’t go on gun. Broker and buy ammunition that you cannot guarantee is factory new ammunition if you want reload then loaded yourself well. Unfortunately we’re out of time for the public free part of podcast available on your favorite podcast player. However the next half an hour of the interview is available on patriots. So if you’re on patriot. I want you to stick with me. We’ll get started with that in just a second if you’re listening on your favorite podcast player or you’re listening on youtube or one of the video distribution channels than thank you very much for all of your support and wherever you go. Whatever you do stay safe. You’ve been listening to the GunGuyTV podcast.